Ann Monk, nee Gutteridge, missing date and place of birth

Question

There is an issue with Ann's DoB. The image of the 1841 census is quite clear giving an age 35 on the census date of 6th of June. However, no record of a birth in the local of her marriage on  05 Apr 1823 at Bramfield, Hertfordshire in 1805-6 has yet been found. Furthermore, a DoB of 1806 is late for a marriage in 1823 (at 17), and first child born on 16 Jan 1825. There is a possible baptism 11 3/4 miles from Bramfield on 11 Feb i798 at Cottered St John.  

This dilemma also prevents the identification of her parents.

N.B. In the 1820s a teen marriage and first child was not so uncommon, and we must recall that people did not move very far through their lives 

Thanks for any assistance.

Answer 1

The number on the 1841 census is clearly 35 not 25. Ages in this census were rounded down to the next 5 years, so her age could be anything in the range 35-39.

If you use the GRO online index, rather than familySearch, it gives her age – 36, registered in the Oct-Dec quarter.

Her burial must therefore be the one at Watton at Stone on 24 December 1841, age 36: https://www.findmypast.co.uk/transcript?id=GBPRS%2FD%2F72214208%2F1

Her date of birth is therefore implied to be slightly earlier than you have it, 1804-1805.

However, the marriage record has the 'with consent of' struck through, implying that the minister thought both bride and groom were over 21. If he was right, then she was born by 1802. This is not far off 1804, and the sort of variation that often occurs.

As well as the baptism at Cottered in 1798, there is one there in 1801 and also one at Standon which is a bit closer to Watton.

Comments

Thanks for the reply.  My mistype of the census age is down to my thick fingers.

I, and it seems the people who transcribe the records were not aware of the rounding issue.  Gotta wonder why the enumerators did that?

Thanks for the FindMypast link, I will use that.  It puts her birthday between June 6th and December.

I looked at the 1801 baptism on https://www.freereg.org.uk/cms/about  That child died and was buried at Cottered in 1839 https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/5eeb9dfef493fdfedd848389/ann-gutteridge-burial-hertfordshire-cottered-1839-03-30?locale=en

Regards

Nick

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I don't think you can take the ages given as being so precise as to calculate a period of 6 months from them. You don't know who supplied the information on the census or the death and burial records, or how well they knew her age. Also, as I noted, they are not compatible with the marriage record. Which age has been 'adjusted' cannot be said. Did she overstate her age in order to get married without needing parental consent?  Or did someone understate it in the census so that she did not appear older than her husband?

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Both census and burial record are consistent.  Would a humble bricklayer be that bothered about his wife being a couple or three years older than him?

I would be interested in an original copy of the marriage lines, can you provide a link for me to use?  Also for the Standon record?  Frdeereg found nothing there.

There is still the dilemma that the only feasible birth record that I can find is 1798, a full 7 or 8 years before her husband stated to the  priest at her burial.

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Marriage on FMP: https://www.findmypast.co.uk/transcript?id=GBPRS%2FM%2F73052355%2F2

Standon baptism 13 Mar 1801, daughter of John and Sarah, and twin(?) to Catherine:  https://www.findmypast.co.uk/transcript?id=GBPRS%2FB%2F71575470%2F1 

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Thanks, the Birth is of interest, but the marriage link pointed to a marriage to Downey, not Monk.  I have found the original marriage record, marriage by banns.

From the Wikipedia page on Hardwicke's Act:

While the parent of a minor could forbid the banns and so prevent a marriage from going ahead, a marriage by banns that took place without active parental dissent was valid. This gave rise to the practice whereby underage couples would resort to a parish where they were not resident to have the banns called without their parents' knowledge. Since the Act specifically prohibited the courts from inquiring into the parties' place of residence after the marriage had been celebrated, such evasive marriages were still valid.

 

I'll add the birth record into the research note.

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The transcription of Downey is wrong. If you look at the image it says James Dorington Monk not James Downey.

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It is OK.  I found the parish register entry for Gutteridge - Monk, stating marriage by bans.  Which in itself does not prevent under age marriages.